2008 Season, Game Post

Game 75: Tigers at Padres

238 Comments

PREGAME: The Tigers rap up their road portion of interleague today in San Diego. The pitching match-up will be Justin Verlander and Randy Wolf.

Miguel Cabrera is Hungry Like A Wolf (I know, it’s awful) with 22 career plate appearances, 10 hits, 2 homers, and 3 walks against Randy. Lefties have been hitting Wolf to the rune of a 997 OPS this year so I’d like to see Granderson stay in the lineup. Wolf has been much tougher at Petco with a 2.45 ERA there and a 5.84 everywhere else.

DET @ SDP, Sunday, June 22, 2008 Game Preview – Baseball-Reference.com

Game Time 4:05

POSTGAME: I like the winning. Justin Verlander had the live fastball thing working with 10 K’s. However he also had 5 walks, 2 of them intentional. That makes for a lot of pitches and he was at 115 when he was lifted with one out in the 6th.

  • Very nice job by Bobby Seay coming into a 2 on, 1 out situation and getting out of it unscathed.
  • Pudge Rodriguez walked twice and picked up his first unassisted homer of the season. Don’t look now, but his OBP is up to .325.
  • Magglio Ordonez found his extra base groove with a double and a homer, following up on his homer last night.
  • Granderson hit the ball well again today, with only one hit to show for it. But seeing him take a left hander to the warning track twice was encouraging.
  • Joel Zumaya came in with the lead, and left with the lead. But he did allow a walk and a couple hits and had the tying run gunned down (closely) at the plate.

White Sox are down 6 in the 9th as I write this. Assuming the Cubs can hang on, the Tigers are only 5 games back with 87 games left on the schedule. That so seems doable.

238 thoughts on “Game 75: Tigers at Padres”

  1. not only did Renteria not want to bunt last night his opening at bat today he didn’t want to get a hit … ball way out of the strikezone …too hot to run the bases

  2. That was a bad pitch by Verlander on the Gonzalez home run. He threw back-to-back ugly breaking balls and then came with a predictable fast ball right down the middle.

  6. JV looks shaky here. Trouble locating his fastball and hurts himself throwing the ball away…

  8. sometimes it is the simle things that befuddle the Tigers..first a favorable count at 2-0…even a fly ball…even a ground ball they aren’t going to double you up…or even stretching the imagination a hit Granderson

  10. 5 K’s thru 2 innings for Verlander. 44 pitches too.

    Time to hit the run support button on my keyboard.

  11. I’d like to see a showdown between Wolf and Fossum for who can throw the softest.

  13. you battle a guy for 9 pitches then swing at a pitch that almost takes your head off..for a K …Rayburn

    …nice job Carlos as I was typing this

  16. Verlander was squeezed on the fifth pitch to Gonzalez. And look at the first pitch strike call against Miggy in the top of the inning. We’ve seen some very poor balls and strike calls this trip.

  26. So there have been exactly 2 balls hit into the field of play against Verlander.

  27. Amazingly, Gameday is claiming the FSN gun to be slow by about 2 mph. They have V hitting 99 on every other pitch

  28. As nice as the K’s are for Verlander, a couple first pitch infield pop out s would be helpful.

  30. He’s obviously bored with the the whole “home run” thing. He’ll try to hit for average for a while.

  31. This is a sight to see. Too bad JV’s pitch count is so high, otherwise he would be on pace for 24 Ks! I would at least like to see him reach 15.

  34. Wolf throws these eephus-like curves constantly. Marcus hammers one for a single.

  35. I will have to say. Leyland’s every other day for the catcher idea seems to be working so far. Pudge looks alot better at the plate.

  38. I still would have rather seen a bunt…poor baseball…lefty lefty for Granderson…

  45. Marcus should have been able to tag and advance on the Grandy fly ball. Definitely not the place for the bunt.

  48. I was questioning the desire for Granderson to bunt with Verlander on deck — which in my opinion is an obviosly poor decision.

  52. I would rather see the Tigers with the mindset that at least once every month or so a bunt is in order with a bunter at the plate runners on 1 and 2 or winning run potential late in games…JL just never does

  53. Leyland sure likes that double-steal play with sloooooow runners on the bases. Some year he might get lucky and it will work.

  56. The fastballs to Carlos were in the other batter’s box, not over the plate. Ugh.

  61. Edgar out slowed them to second they thought he was holding while he was running

  66. btw, Michael Barrett remains one of the worst defensive catchers I have ever seen in my life

  71. Because it was Adrian Gonzalez, pretty much the scariest hitter in the NL right now.

  74. Verlander gives up one run, but works out of a hell of a jam in what was probably his last inning. 3-2 Tigers

  75. Your right on Dave. He has been the best hitter in the NL lately. Besides Larry Jones.

  76. Who comes out of the pen to finish this game? RODNEY. Ha Ha. I’m sure Zoom will pitch later.

  77. I guess Verlander gets one more inning. I agree with that. I’ll come out and say that right now. No second guessing billfer.

  78. Grandy smokes 2 balls and nothing to show for it.

    I’m sorry, you have to pinch hit Verlander here. He’s got very little left and a runner in scoring positioin

  81. I have a feeling this is going to be one of those games where Verlander does pretty good, but Leyland leaves him in 3 batters too long

  84. Slim chance of scoring a run there with a pinch hitter. 1 in 4 chance the way Wolf is pitching.
    They are saving Polonco for something better.

  85. Wow. If that pickoff throw doesn’t hit Green, he’s standing on second base.

  87. I’ll take 1 chance in 4 over none at all. That’s two scoring opportunities squandered by the genius/

  91. great job …I just hope we don’t piss this one away 50-50 chance only cause we are ahead

  92. To bad Verlander couldn’t have an easy inning here. With exception of the walks a good job by Verlander.

  93. I don’t care. Two cheap hits. I know they are still hits, but it’s not like they were smoked.

  95. Didn’t someone say last night that Seay’s numbers are better against righties?

  96. Bobby needs to join the strike-throwing bullpen sessions with Rodney.

    Phew. Game-saving defense by Cabrera.

  101. Wow. Watch a catch. I hope his eyes were open for that one. I believe Miggy is getting alot better over there. That catch, and earlier getting off the bag to save an error on Guillen.

  102. Perfect managing there. The result really couldn’t have worked out any better.

  108. Maggs doubles and Guillen runs from first to home. Fortunately, a bad throw got by Barrett, because Guillen would have otherwise been out easily. 4-2 Tigers

  110. Does anybody else believe that Raburn could use a little trip down to Toledo? In the 40 games he’s played in, only twice has he had more than 1 hit. Get some confidence back in the guy.

  113. It would of taken a perfect throw to get Guillen, and it was almost perfect otherwise Guillen would of scored easily.

  114. Part of Raburn’s troubles might be that he has had less than 80PA. Most of his games have been as a defensive replacement/pinch hiiter/pinch runner.

  116. I wonder if it is required that we walk the first guy on every time we go to the bullpen to start an inning

  117. that’s what i’m talking about Vince, he needs some more pt but where at, I don’t have the answer.

  126. Zoom made that inning look easy. Way to hold the lead.

    Well, that’s what I learned in my business communications class. Writing in a negative tone was prohibited in the class. For some reason I haven’t been able to change my positive tone since.

  128. Thames with an outfield assist saves the inning from getting out of hand. 4-3 Tigers

  129. Thames doesn’t move that fast, but he sure does get good results. He pulled off the old rope a dope play.

  130. thank you for fundemental baseball…get the ball quickly. hit your cut off …nice one bounce throw good tag,,,,helpfull call…OUT

  138. Chief Monday

    The positive tone post was pretty funny. I was cracking up when I read it.

  139. Jonathan, the fact that Raburn is so versatile in the field works against him as well. He’ll get a rare start here and there, but mostly because of his status as a replacement specialist, he probably won’t ever get to string too many ABs together.

  141. Grandy is hitting really well right now. He had 2 hard outs, and now this hit. Very encouraging.

  142. Chief:

    Exactly. The bottom of the 7th was managed perfectly by Leyland – couldn’t have turned out better. Give credit where credit is due, I say.

  144. lets have 3 shots down to INGE so he doesn’t forget how to make those great plays at 3rd…we don’t need his stinking hittin…just make those plays

  145. This every other game thing really seems to agree with Pudge. Of course it doesn’t seem to agree too much with Inge and means we have to witness him flailing away every other day.

  147. HBP to start the 8th for Miner. It will be a miarcle if we survive these last two innings.

  148. too save time lets just have the other team just put there leadoff hitter on…these games are taking too long

  155. Miner apparently has a guardian angel watching over him.

    Why did Black get tossed?

  156. The Ump said “let me do my f’n job”, then Black said “you can’t do you’re f’n job, you’re blind.

  157. He got tossed cuz he hurt the umpire’s feelings. No room for cold pricklies on his diamond. Only warm fuzzies will be tolerated.

    Coming up in the bottom of the 9th. Jonesy! I hope everyone is tall enough to ride….

  160. Vince – Black was arguing the fair ball call on Barrett’s DP ball. Barrett never left the box, pretending that the ball hit his foot and was foul. Meanwhile, the play carried on with Brandon making a great play on the grounder just barely clipping the lead runner.

    Black got up in he umps face and stayed there too long.

  164. Jones just earned alot of respect from me. I can’t believe he stays in the game and gets a DP ball next pitch.

  166. Jones pitches better when he is in pain. That’s why he usually loads up the bases before closing the door. Done deal..

  168. San Diego was 0-36 after trailing in the 9th ..
    Tigers are 32-0 after leading in the ninth…tell you about that 9th inning

  169. Nice 6 game road trip. Go Cubs. Indians already lost, to bad the twinkies won.

  179. Just when everyone is ready to send the old horses like Pudge and Jones to the glue factory, they show us something more. Go Tigers!

  180. Great road trip. We took 4 of 6 and had a great chance to win them all. They are playing an exciting brand of baseball and it doesn’t look like it is going to stop anytime soon.

  181. Go Cubs go! Go Cubs go! Hey Chicago, what you say — “the Cubs are gonna win today.”

  182. I’m glad Verlander got that win. He deserved it. Next up – the hated Cardinals.

  183. The Tigs got a lot of help from the Padres today, but a win is a win. Earlier in the year the breaks weren’t going there way, but that seems to have changed now. I’m still not convinced they will ever live up to all the pre-season hype, but at least they are still in the running for the division, which is probably the only way they make the playoffs, since it looks like the wild card team most likely won’t come from the Central.

  184. cib, I’ll be happy to wait til the end of the season to send Jones and Pudge to the glue factory. Since we don’t seem to be missing Sheffield too much, he can probably go right now though.

  185. The last time I seen someone get hit in the knee that hard was Nancy Kerrigan; and she cried like a baby.

  188. Didn’t get to see the game, but I think this says it all:

    further upthread: “Game-saving defense by Cabrera.”

    Carolyn and I are well pleased.

  190. 5-0 Cubs.

    By the time we play the twinkies in two weeks, we’ll be chasing them instead of the chisox.

  192. Did you know the Cubs haven’t won a World Series since 1908? Miller and Morgan don’t think we do.

  193. Told you we wouldn’t lose another game in this series! I’ll take 4 out of every 6 any time I can get ’em. I like our odds coming up in this series against the Cards.

  195. Ron: I’ve got to get the I Told You So’s in there before I start regressing to the mean which is firmly set at “never gets any predictions right.”

  197. Nice updates, Dave BW. You’re reinstated.

    And now for something completely different…

  198. TIGERS RELIEVERS ENTERING GAME WITH RUNNER(S) ON (through 74 games)

    For purposes of this discussion, consider pitchers to be responsible for any run that scores on their watch. Also, HITS/BB may include the odd HBP and ROE.

    (PITCHER – ERA* – IP – HITS/BB – RUNS)

    Rapada – 0.00 – 2.1 – 4 – 0
    Dolsi – 8.11 – 3.1 – 7 – 3
    Jones – 10.84 – 1.2 – 2 – 2
    Lopez – 13.51 – 7.1 – 9 – 11
    Seay – 17.06 – 6.1 – 14 – 12
    Grilli – 18.00 – 1 – 2 – 2
    Miner – 18.42 – 7.1 – 16 – 15
    Bautista – 20.30 – 1.1 – 3 – 3
    Beltran – 27.11 – 1.2 – 7 – 5
    Zumaya – 27.27 – .2 – 2 – 2
    Cruceta – 47.37 – 1.1 – 5 – 7
    Fossum – 95.45 – .2 – 7 – 7
    Rodney – 109.09 – .1 – 4 – 4

    TEAM – 18.42 ERA* – 35.2 IP – 83 H/BB – 73 R

    20% of runs allowed have been let in during 4 games worth of work. It’s taken Fossum just .2 IP to let in 2% of 2008 runs in these appearances alone.

  200. Sean can you do a list like that when the relief pitcher enters at the start of an inning….JL doesn’t match up much if at all L/l or R/R ..he basically expects a pitcher to complete an inning he starts ,although he has been matching up a little more lately…..

  201. judpma

    I know even without doing the list you suggest that the Tigers bullpen is better coming in at the start of an inning, although it should be pointed out that in my list above, a good many of those runners that scored were on base due to the previous reliever, not a starter.

    These lists are hard work. I suggest you compile the one you’d like to see. Go to baseball-reference.com, click on Detroit in the standings, click on schedule, when the schedule comes up, click on box for each game and then scroll down to the play by play account and skim through it for relievers coming into the game at the start of an inning. For each such occurrence/pitcher, record the number of outs, baserunners allowed, and runs allowed while that pitcher is pitching. Tote it all up for each pitcher when you’ve accumulated all the game by game data. If you discover an easier way, let me know.

    I was more interested in bullpen performance coming in with men on, because I consider it the most critical test of what a bullpen is made of. I won’t say what it appears the Detroit bullpen is made of.

  202. “The Tigers are 11-1 this season when Thames homers, and 50-19 since 2004”

    Hmmm. I think I like it.

  203. On the other hand, Thames has gotta come in for some heat on the Tigers 14-22 record in games he’s in where he doesn’t hit a home run. This reveals that Mr. Nice Guy isn’t such a team player after all, saving all the HRs for wins when they’re going to get a lot of attention. Trade this cancer, I say.

  204. Hey we’ve made up 9 games in the last few weeks… not too shabby, Tigres!

    I think that’s 7 games they’ve made up. I think they were 12 out when the hot streak started. I don’t think they were ever 14 out. 🙂

  205. Sean: Your theories intrigue me and I’d like to subscribe to your newsletter.

  206. If you want to measure the Tigers bullpen w/runners on base vs. starting an inning, it would be helpful to know how they compare against the rest of the league, though. It seems to me that most relievers would have more trouble in those situations than coming in with no one on base. I dunno.

  207. It would be useful to know the league norm, Chris. As awful as my numbers look, I’m sure there are bullpens doing worse. But I don’t need a league norm to have an intuitive sense that 83 hits/baserunners and 73 runs allowed in 35.2 IP really, really blows. Also, it’s discouraging to see that only one pitcher – ONE – stands out as good. You’d think a bad team total would involve some real blowups by a few guys skewing things to look worse than they are.

    We’re currently in the process of retooling the whole newsletter operation. Demand is at an all-time high, so writing out 3 copies per month in longhand won’t do any more. I’m considering using the copy machine at work now (don’t tell) and charging a subscription fee. We apologize for the delay, and thank you for your continued support.

  208. Well yes, those numbers do look pretty dreary. On the other hand, looking at a composite of the season I don’t think the bullpen has cost an inordinate amount of the 39 losses. Also off of the top of my head I can think of a handful of games where they pitched 5+ scoreless innings out of the ‘pen. I’m not going to argue that it’s the greatest relief corps in the league or anything, but they’ve got some guys out there who can get the job done. And I’m willing to give Rodney and Zumaya a bit of slack for a week or two until they get accustomed to facing big leaguers again.

  209. I think the Tigers pen is usually a lot better when the Tigers have the lead. They have a 2.88 ERA in sv situations. In non sv situations they have a 5.13 ERA.

  210. “I don’t think the bullpen has cost an inordinate amount of the 39 losses.”

    I agree, and of course Rodney and Zumaya are just getting started. I wasn’t out to prove a point with my investigation; I was just curious. But the point I didn’t set out to prove seems to be that with the hitting having become consistent and timely, starting pitching having become close to otherworldly, and defense having tightened up some, the bullpen may start causing an inordinate amount of losses until at least 2 guys step forward as highly trustworthy in cleaning up messes and putting out fires. This is what relief pitchers are supposed to do, what they’re supposed to thrive on.

    If I was a relief pitcher, I think I’d be bored if there weren’t runners on and less than 2 outs when I came in. My real name is Todd Jones.

  211. As we all know numbers show us what we want to see in a lot of cases..as deceiving as Jones numbers are I believe he is 15 for 15 in save attempts…so would it matter if his ERA or all runs allowed were 8.50 to us…other than our heart stoppages that is…..we just need the save out of him

  212. Mith: I think he means 12 games under .500 to 3 games under.

    In that sense, we’ve made up 9 games.

  213. “In that sense, we’ve made up 9 games.”

    Yeah, that’s the more important sense to me. I’m looking at .500 with longing, not much concerned with what the Twins or Sox are doing.

  214. Relievers like Jones need the adrenaline rush–these other guys are living in fear of getting hit, so they throw balls until they really get in trouble.

    I loved Maddux’s last inning the other night-4 pitches and 3 outs and that was with Pudge taking a strike!

  215. Gil’s BA is below the Cabrera Line again. It was bound to happen.

    Punk.

  216. Yes. Gil no likey Petco, apparently. Seems to like the home park a little better (.279/.361/.481 vs. .272/.339/.429). He’ll get it going against the Redbirds. BTW did anyone think at this late date that Gil would have a SLG 100 points below his previous 3 season totals? That’s vexing, when you consider he used to play half his games in Yellowstone Park. I mean, Jellystone Park.

  217. And has anyone seen this WGN commercial with Ozzie Guillen and Lou Piniella, um, rapping? I tried to link to it, but the filter shot it down. Highest of high comedy, I tells ya.

  218. Chris, do they mention rats? I heard something on the radio about Ozzie and rats. But maybe this was one of his serious statements.

  219. “You go to take batting practice and the rats are bigger than pigs out there. I think the rats are lifting weights.”

    — White Sox manager Ozzie Guillen, on the Cubs’ Wrigley Field

  220. vtfanmv5: These are the reasons I love Oz. Though the White Sox can collectively go eff themselves.

  221. vtfanmv5, was that from the commercial, or just another mild everyday opinion from the Oz?

  222. Just a mild everyday opinion, I believe. I’m interested in finding this rap though.

  223. There just has to be a website somewhere with the collected wisdom of Ozzie captured in audio.

  224. Sean: If you Google Ozzie + Piniella + WGN + rap, you can see the commercial. It’s the first link that comes up.

  225. Thanks, Chris. Got it.

    Way too PG. They need to let Lou and Ozzie get down with they bad selves. I want to see the cable TV version.

  226. MIKE R, I’ve never seen your “mean” side and I don’t ever want to. I hear it could be ugly.

  228. I’d like to know the inning and score when Marcus homers. Is it, “I hope I get a good pitch to hit” or ” A home run right now is what we need”.

  229. ron: Ask, and you shall receive –

    1: 4th inning, 2-2 score off of Jon Lester (2 run shot)
    2: 5th inning, down 2-1 off Andy Pettite (2 run shot)
    3: 3rd inning, ahead 4-1 off Jarrod Washburn (granny)
    4: 1st inning, 0-0 off Joe Saunders (2 run shot)
    5: 5th inning, ahead 3-0 off Joe Saunders (2 run shot)
    6: 8th inning, down 3-2 off Masahide Kobayashi (solo)
    7: 2nd inning, 0-0 off Javier Vasquez (3 run jimmy jack)
    8: 5th inning, 0-0 off Derek Lowe (solo)
    9: 4th inning, down 4-3 off Brad Penny (2 run bomb)
    10: 6th inning, ahead 3-0 off Chan Ho Park (solo)
    11: 2nd inning, 0-0 off Tim Lincecum (solo)
    12: 4th inning, tied 1-1 off Tim Lincecum (2 run job)
    13: 9th inning, ahead 3-1 off Vinnie Chulk (solo)
    14: 7th inning, tied 5-5 off Justin Hampson (2 run)

    A lot of those were very timely. And off some good pitchers, too.

  230. Thames 2008 HRs:

    Top 4th score 2-2 (2-run HR)
    Top 5th score 2-1 (2-run HR)
    Bottom 3rd score 4-1 (Grand Slam)
    Top 1st score 0-0 (2-run HR)
    Top 5th score 3-0 (2-run HR)
    Bottom 8th score 2-3 (solo)
    Bottom 2nd score 0-0 (3-run HR)
    Bottom 5th score 0-0 (solo)
    Bottom 4th score 3-4 (2-run HR)
    Bottom 6th score 3-0 (solo)
    Top 2nd score 0-0 (solo)
    Top 4th score 1-1 (2 run HR)
    Top 9th score 3–1 (solo)
    Top 7th score 5-5 (2-run HR)

  231. Oh yeah, real fancy, listing the pitcher and everything.

    Whatever!

    Mine’s better, right, Ron?

  232. Chris in Dallas left out the pitch count. Pretty sloppy work, I’d say. And what about temp at game time? Huh? Huh?

  234. Yeah, Chris, how could I not notice the jimmy jack? Frankly. I thought that was showboating. You already had me beat by half an hour. Unfairly, I might add, since I’m busy at work.

  235. Ron – Pitch counts on Thames’s Country Funk bombs:

    5 first pitch
    1 at 0-1
    1 at 1-1
    1 at 2-1
    1 at 0-2
    1 at 1-2
    2 at 2-2
    2 on full count

    6 boom-diggitys were hit after the first pitch thrown was a ball. 6 yardboys were slammed on a 2-strike count.

    Outs situation:

    5 with none out
    6 with 1 out
    3 with 2 outs

    Thus far he’s been shut down with 3 outs, but he’s due.

    Chris will appear presently to sort all this out by pitcher and instance.

  236. Thames is not only due for a 3 out HR, but he’s yet to connect on a 4-0 or 0-3 pitch. We should see some correction to the mean in those categories.

  237. Good call, Chris. I get the sense that fans are looking for a fresh approach to understanding the confusing plethora, the swirling miasma, the overflowing diaspora of modern stats, and you and I are on the cutting edge.

  238. Yes, Sean, it’s hard to make sense of it all sometimes. Fortunately we here at DTW Comments Central provide a beacon of light in the dark storm of baseball sabermetrics. Or something to that effect.

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