Yes, the ejection of Porcello greatly impacted the outcome of the game, and yes I’ve already ripped into the umpires for the ejection. But the umpires did not cost the Tigers the game, nor did Kevin Youkilis and his hissy fit. Regardless, the Tigers will be feeling the repercussions of this game for the rest of the series.
The umpiring was atrocious the whole night and it didn’t just go against the Tigers. In fact it led to the Tigers offensive outburst in the first. Guillen got away with intereference on his take out slide breaking up a double play in the first. Then the Tigers were gifted a caught stealing in the 2nd (leading to the ejection of Terry Francona) where Lambert was handed an out because he wasn’t capable of notching one on his own. The strike zone was a complete and utter joke (11 Red Sox pitches out of the strike zone called strikes, 5 Tigers pitches out of the strike zone called strikes, 3 Tigers pitches in the zone called balls, 1 Red Sox pitch in the zone called a ball). It was just a horrible job of umpiring all the way around.
The Tigers offense struggled again despite the 5 runs. The 3 in the first came on 2 solid singles, a questionable HBP, an error, and a slide out of the baseline, and another solid single. The offense was then held to 2 hits until the 9th inning when they got to Papelbon for 2 runs.
Lambert was awful…again…and the only nice thing you can say is that he pitched 5 innings. He also became the first Tiger since Mel Rojas to give up at least 5 runs in consecutive relief outings. (Eulogio De La Cruz did it also…sort of…the first game was as a Tiger and the second game was a year later as a Marlin)
At least Alex Avila is still hitting. And Ordonez tripled in back to back games with assists from J.D. Drew.
Other fallout
As mentioned during the FS Detroit broadcast, the X-rays on Miguel Cabrera’s hand were negative, which is the good news. But according to Jim Leyland’s presser after the game Cabrera was pretty sore and is day to day. Also, Lambert was jettisoned and Freddy Dolsi was recalled. Dolsi pitched last night so I can’t see him giving the Tigers too many innings today. And then there is the issue of Armando Galarraga and the flu and who knows if he’ll be able to go tonight. Eddie Bonine pitched on Sunday so he wouldn’t be available as a spot starter.
The umps didn’t cost the Tigers the game? How can you say that? Maybe Porcello throws a shutout. Who knows?
Good follow up to your earlier thread…the balls/strikes were inconsistent and biased, in addition to the ejection BECAUSE Youklis charged the mound.
Disappointing that we had the edge in pitching matcup for each of the first two games and didn’t win either one. Now we get to face a red-hot Beckett while we send out… who, exactly?
Maybe the tide will turn and we can pull this one out, because we need to start winning some of these road games.
Lambert sucked, the Officals were terrible. NICE take down by Porcello..
Another sense of the fallout is how the fight affects the team. I’ve thought for a while that the team has been just too passive. Maybe the fact that the youngest player on the team (heck, the youngest player i the majors, no?) not only stood up for the best player on the team (and yes, I am saying Porcello’s plunk waas intentional), but also took down and end up on top of one of the league’s baddest bad*sses has got to be a good thing.
There is also the issue of how various teammates acquitted themselves in the in-fight dynamics. I’m no expert here, but clearly one can be more or less productive and protective of one’s teammates. (for example, on the Boston side, the Sox I’m sure noticed and appreciated Ortiz’s efforts to pull various Tigers off of the pile that was building on top of Youkilis.
One more potential fallout: Porcello himself. Does it give him more confidence? does it make him lose concentration? Does he have to skip a start due to suspension? Did his shoulder get hurt during the donnybrook?
hehe, donnybrook. I love that word, reminds me of Mickey Redmond.
Ernie Harwell, who also used refered to such back-and-forths as “rhubarbs.”
I believe he may have also used donnybrook and brouhaha. I always liked also when the manager would come out for a “confab” at the mound…
There is no way on God’s green Earth that Ernie Harwell used the term “brouhaha”. What are you smoking? Or are you trying to be witty?
The fight dynamics can be interesting. First thing you notice is Yuck (spelling intentional) gets to Porcello, which rarely happens. Usually the catcher will prevent this; Avila (only his 3rd game) was slow to react. (Which is a point for the non-intentional argument–highly doubtful Porcello intentionally hits Yuck on his own; if it was called, Avila would be in on it, so why so slow to react?).
My take was that If Porcello would have backed up or moved to his right, Inge would have intercepted; as it was Raburn got there first but whiffed, like an outfielder charging a sinking liner that short-hops under his glove, and had to turn around and head back for them–they were almost out to 1st base by then. Polanco got there next but also over-ran them, and knocked Inge off-course.
By then the Red Sox 1st base coach was there and grabbed Inge; Inge threw him off and ended up being first there to separate Yuck and Porcello, and ended up on the bottom of the pile with them. (Overall quite a performance by Inge, although not quite equal to his role in the Carmona-Sheffield brouhaha).
Van Slyke took over from Lamont at trying to keep Ed Jack out of trouble, which might have been the best move of all–Edwin was clearly fired up, and Lamont was no match alone, and the last thing the Tigers needed was an Ed Jack suspension.
Move Verlander’s start up 18 hours (he only threw 88 pitches last time out) and pitch Porcello tomorrow (he only threw 15 pitches last night).
Hell let’s just throw Porcello out there again.
I definitely like the idea of those two pitching the next two games, no matter what order.
As a Tiger fan, I feel that we were cheated big time and hope Josh Beckett gets what he deserves Today.
I love the idea of throwing Porcello out there again. Won’t happen, but god that would be great.
And screw it. On his 90th pitch, have him plunk another batter.
I don’t know if he beaned Youkilis on purpose or if it was an accident, but I was glad to see it happen.
I mean come on. You work your entire life to get into the major leagues and then you have a chance to ding Kevin Youkilis with a fastball? How do you pass that up?
It’s like trying to hit the cart kid at the driving range. You HAVE to do it.
I half expected Porcello to just turn around and start running into the outfield like when Rod Allen charged the mound in Japan. (I can’t watch that enough.) Instead he did the whole backpeddle, side-step, let the other guy’s momentum be his downfall move, which is typically what I use in any sort of confrontation. Do you think that Youk simply thought to himself, “If there’s one guy who’s not going to Nolan Ryan me it’s this baby faced kid.”
Hehe love the Allen clip. Weird how once Porcello and Yuck got separated he was just standing there, almost ignored, and Yuck just turned and headed for the dugout. Usually the principles are the centers of attention for the secondary skirmishes that break out.
I wasn’t thinking Nolan Ryan though; I was hoping Porcello would play the Carmona on his noggin.
Youklis wet his pants. That’s why he left so quickly.
Man, Youkilis must have felt like he was assaulting a child in Porcello, unfortunately for him though, Porcello owned him!
Both suspended for five games…………..WTF?
Youkilis, Porcello suspended 5 games each
“Watson penalized Porcello for intentionally throwing pitches at Victor Martinez(notes) in the first inning and Youkilis in the second.
In addition, Detroit pitched Edwin Jackson(notes) was fined for what Watson said were aggressive actions.”
Yes, you read that correctly FOR INTENTIONALLY THROWING PITCHES AT VICTOR MARTINEZ. Nothing for any of the Red Sox pitchers, who, like, hit more Tigers.
No favoritism here though, please move on, nothing to see…
This just keeps getting worse. What a bunch of BS.
5 games for Rick is ridiculous, and Youkilis should have gotten 6-7 (what Sexson got). Typical East coast crap.
Now I’d definitely love to see them start Porcello again this series, while his appeal is pending…
Beanball is a losing battle for the Tigers, especially in Fenway Park. Never should have gotten sucked into this in the first place. The Red Sox needed a fire lit and we walked right into it. Good luck trying to salvage a game out of this series…
Agree that it will be tough to get a W in this series.
But this could very well light a fire under the Tigers as well. After all, I doubt the Sox are feeling “wronged” by the league’s decision.
Whereas it’s pretty easy to see how the Tigers as a team could feel slighted by the commissioner’s ridiculously-biased decision.
Youkilis went after our prized rookie. Marcus Thames, E-Jax and the rest of the Tiger’s were having none of it. Trust me, they rushed the field a little faster because of how valuable Porcello is to this organization.
Now I gotta imagine they’re feeling pissed and I hope to see them play with some fire and passion tonight.
Beckett’s command better be flawless tonight. Because if he so much as grazes a Tiger, Beckett might end getting some dirt on those pretty necklaces of his.
Both suspended, both fined. Isn’t that lovely?
Regardless of your opinion about who did what and deserved whatever or whatnot, one thing’s clear–it worked out well for the Red Sox. Even more clearly the Red Sox won the game. So you have to be pretty happy with that as a Boston fan, right?
For some reason though, the Boston fans seem still worked up about it. And the funny thing is they are all insisting that Youkilis “threw down” Porcello. Well, hey they’re fans, that’s what fans do; we’d probably be saying somewhat similar things if it were reversed I suppose. But apparently the fun of winning is dimmed a bit by seeing Youkilis become a laughingstock outside of Boston.
But the media reaction is disturbing.
Here is the AP description:
(AP) “Youkilis led off the second inning and was hit in the back with the first pitch. He dropped his bat and ran toward Porcello, throwing his batting helmet at the pitcher—and missing—before wrapping him up and bringing him to the ground. ”
(Yes, it really says Youkilis took down Porcello).
Or how about this in the Boston Globe:
http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2009/08/12/things_picked_up_after_takedown/
“The kid righty was backpedaling when a sprinting Youk flung his helmet at him, then wrapped him up and wrestled him to the ground like a baby calf.”
I actually went and watched two different replays to make sure I wasn’t deluded about what I had actually seen. Nope.
Now it’s reasonable to say, oh big deal, it doesn’t matter who took down who, which has some truth to it. But I think it does matter. If you can’t trust the media to accurately describe an event–objectively–well, then where does that leave you? Seriously.
There are some funny comments on the ESPN board concerning Youkilis and his “takedown”.
Couple of the best:
“Youkilis should be suspended for an additional game for being taken down by a 20-year old pitcher.”
“Youkilis should look into taking a women’s self defense class.”
I don’t know, I suppose I’m being silly. I just expect the media to be more reliable than a fan forum.
Just look who ended up on top. Porcello made a nifty sidestep move and gave Youk a lateral throwdown. I have to give it up to the kid, that was pretty slick. Only those with RoseSox colored glasses could see it any differently.
Know what’s really stupid, is that Youk was still awarded 1B for the HBP after he charged the mound. He went out of the baseline and never touched 1B, then he went straight to the dugout. That should be an automatic out. Is there a rule for this?
This is an editorial by Shaughnessy, not a news item. It’s the norm for columnists to use hyperbole and opinion to make their points. Besides, who cares who won the fight or how it’s being reported? It’s not relevant to anything – it’s not like they’re misreporting facts about the game.
Yes it is a column–which is not the same as an editorial–and there is a difference between hyperbole (exaggeration) and inaccuracy. And I mentioned the “who cares” aspect of it. I do.
And there are still standards for columnists, who are expected to be giving opinion. They are also expected to give opinion without factual inaccuracy (and especially without libel).
And the Youkilis-Porcello confrontation IS a fact of the game. It’s no different than if he would have said a third baseman bounced a throw to first when he didn’t. But hey, who cares, either way he’s out, right?
You’re right – column, not editorial.
Why a reference to libel?
I’m just saying I wouldn’t get too worked up about an interpretation of the fight, as silly as it may be – people read these guys (just like Drew Sharp) for entertainment, not accuracy.
I tend not to read Drew Sharp…because he’s so “entertaining”. I also don’t view entertainment and accuracy as being mutually exclusive. In fact, when it comes to news/reporting (or whatever you want to call it) I generally find that inaccuracy to be detrimental to my entertainment. That’s just me though.
You’ll have a hard time finding any inaccuracy in Drew Sharp (predictions don’t count), just curious opinions. The main reason for adding the Boston Globe example in the first place though is to show how I think things have a way of seeping from non-media opinion (fan forums etc) into columns into news.
Where did the AP reporter get his/her description of the event (which not only is “news,” not “opinion,” but becomes the description of record)?
I’m in agreement with you that it doesn’t matter much, or even at all in a baseball-fan sense; it’s just an example of a larger issue that bugs me in a media-sense. My post is ultimately less about the Porcello-Youkilis fight than it is about reporting.
(The reference to libel is to illustrate that there is an important reason, from the newspaper’s side, to make sure their columnists keep certain reporting standards in mind while opinionating/entertaining. I’m not just assuming this, it really is something that is stressed).
Andre, I agree. I’m just saying most people don’t (and shouldn’t) get their “news” from these people. Just like Fox News, MSNBC and Around the Horn/PTI on ESPN.
Coleman, I agree but I just don’t think who took down who was something they did (or should) put much effort into investigating since it relies to some extent on one’s interpretation and is trivial to the story. I agree that any inaccuracy undermines the credibility of the media though.
Jim Rome totally ripped Youk and the ump crew.
He laughed at how scares Porcello was too…
Seriously, I don’t think he did it on purpose. His expression wasn’t that he meant to hit him. Youk was ridiculous, but the ump crew was even more so.
And FIVE GAMES to Porcello?!?! WTF?!?!
That’s ridiculous!!
It’s ridiculous, but it is inconsequential. The Tigers are planing on limiting his innings anyway. They can appeal it in order to push it to a day of their connivence.
I don’t see it being ridiculous. The end result is he makes his next start one game later than scheduled. It’s not really much of a suspension at all.
The suspension is inconsequential.
The real damage was already done. Ejecting Porcello from last night’s game after 15 pitches was basically an immediate (as in, on-the-spot) one game suspension.
And it practically gifted the Sox with a win.
We could have machines call balls & strikes with an amazing amount of accuracy & consistency. For tradition sake, MLB can keep the ump there to read what the Ump-Bot calls. Or they can just fire all the worst umps and say screw tradition.
I wouldn’t trust the umps to read what the ump-bot calls.
We can have the Ump-bot’s calls compared to the human umps calls. If the human gets one wrong, he is fired or sent to the torture chamber next to the clubhouse.
And how is Porcello suspended the SAME NUMBER of Games as Youk!?!
I get that he’s suspended! But REALLY MLB?!?
Bad judgement.
For a starting pitcher, 5 days suspended means he will miss only one start.
This is the same penalty players usually get for the same situation. I don’t see how anyone can be surprised or upset by it.
Jeff: If there was a warning issued, I would agree.
But no warning was issued in Tuesday’s game. What Porcello did was absolutely within the best traditions of baseball. He can say he didn’t try to hi Yukilis, but he was clearly throwing it nice and tight on purpose.
As I said elsewhere, I think Porcello’s only mistake was throwing that pitch in the second inning, rather than the sixth.
Has anyone heard if they plan to arrest Yukilis for child abuse?